Date: Tue, 21 Jan 1997 12:49:48 -0500 (EST) From: jcook@awod.com (Jesse S. Cook III) Subject: Capacity & Language and Competence Sender: owner-linganth@cc.rochester.edu X-Sender: jcook@awod.com To: linganth@cc.rochester.edu Cc: rjpensal@po10.mit.edu, aaf@u.washington.edu MIME-version: 1.0 Precedence: bulk On 18 January 1997, I posted some "rather non-anthropological remarks" (according to Aaron Fox) that, nevertheless, seem to have initiated a thread uncovering many diffferent POVs. Due to the press of other business, I have not been able to respond to any of the postings heretofore. I am going to do so now in two postings. This is the first:

On 18 January 1997, Rob Pensalfini replied:

"Kerim said: 'Speakers of BE who belong to street gangs are just as [cap]able of logical reasoning as those who speak standard [E]nglish.'

"Jesse asked: 'Has this been empirically proven? If so by whom, and where can the proof be found?'

"Steven Pinker (in *The Language Instinct*, pp. 66ff) gives an example [that] I think is relevant..."

He then goes on to summarize Pinker's summary of *one* of Bloom's tests of his thesis, and ends up with the sarcastic: "Proof of the Whorfian hypothesis that our language constrains the way we think!"

First, a little nit picking: to put Pinker's remarks in perspective, the page reference should be 64-67. Second, This hardly constitutes empirical evidence for Kerim's statement; it is only *one bit* of evidence *contra* Bloom's thesis.

Later, Rob asks: "Or do we become capable of higher-order predicate logic only once we learn the language of predicate logic?" My answer: Just try it without learning the language. Just try speaking German without learning German. How illogical can you get?

Immediately following that, Rob asks: "Can I, therefore, as a speaker of seven languages, claim a greater cognitive capacity than a monolingual person? I think not."

My answer: First, linguistically speaking, of course you have a greater cognitive capacity. (Logically speaking, however, there is room for doubt: the "therefore" in your first sentence is not preceded by any recognizable argument.)

Second: Why do you "think not"? Upon what grounds do you do so?

As an aside, Albert Einstein is reported to have said: "Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by [the completion of formal education]." (He is reported to have said "age eighteen".)

Finally, Rob says: "I [have] yet to meet a language incapable of expressing logic of any complexity imaginable." Well, which one of your seven languages can express "higher-order predicate logic"? Jesse S. Cook III E-Mail: jcook@awod.com Post Office Box 40984 or Charleston, SC 29485 USA 201-9573@mcimail.com "There is only one success--to be able to spend your life in your own way."--Christopher Morley (1890-1957) "...it is not for our faults that we are disliked and even hated, but for our qualities."--Bernard Berenson (1865-1959)